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Front suspension
^ A-1 Tie Rod Ends, for using the S13 knuckle with S12 inner tie rod ends.
My coilover collars are stuck. DAMN RUSTED USED ITAMS!!!111 It should be broken loose tomorrow and hopefully I'll have pictures of it rolling.
[mod edit: use anti-seize]
REAR suspension
I'll have more up later.
looking good!
are those a-1 tie rod ends?
Yep, I still need to roll this car out of the garage and get some S14 rims. Those Z32 ones are toooooo wide in the front. I like how the back sits tho haha. I still need an alignment and other things.
Part list pretty please? I'm gonna be doing this probably next spring after the ca18det goes in.
Looks good.
IggyEGuana @ Aug 9 2007, 01:33 AM
Part list pretty please? I'm gonna be doing this probably next spring after the ca18det goes in.
Looks good.
The list will be up in another thread once I finish writing it down. I don't think a write-up is going to work for me, but I'm sure a parts list will be the same. heheh
I think I'm gonna stick with the Z rims. I just gotta go positive camber near the spindle and a 10mm spacer to clear it. The rears look VERY nice. A little too low for my liking but it's not bad. MORE PIX TOMORROW! And I need to get hardware to mount the stock front sway bar.
Damnit! I ran into some problems. My coilover collars are stuck. DAMN RUSTED USED ITAMS!!!111 It should be broken loose tomorrow and hopefully I'll have pictures of it rolling.
lol that blows man, those coilovers do look a bit haggard. You should rustoleum them to prevent future rustiness
or some anti-seize..
Positive Camber? You mean negative, right?
Looks awesome man. The Z32 wheels look so beffy under the S12 haha
Good to se you got it setup.
I'll post a list here and I'll do an info thread after this one.
Front suspension
-S13 front control arms(with ES bushing)
-S13 spindles
-S13 tension rods(Stock with ES bushings)
-S14 Tension rod bracket(had to oval out one of the holes)
-S12 stock swaybar(need washers and longer bolt to mount it)
-A1 racing tie rod ends
-Tein HA coilovers
-Ichiba 5-lug conversion hubs
-Q45 calipers/rotors(rebuilt)
-ATE Super blue
-HAwks HPS pads
-Z31 SS lines(all bolt up)
REAR Suspension
-Z31 87-89 vented rear control arms(stock axles bolt up)
-Z31 87-89 vented rear rotors/calipers(rebuilt)
-Hawks HPS for Z31
-Mustang AGX shocks(with washers to keep the mustang agx from moving left/right)
-5x8in length 350in/lb springs(no need to cut the control arms for me!)
Rims
Z32 NA with a 10mm spacer in the front. I just gotta get some stretched tires so I can go 5mm all around(I double-stacked 5MM spacers)
All I need left are Rear subframe/diff mounts, Poly spring seats, Z31 poly bushing set, R200 diff and 5speed swap. Eventually I'll get a CA18DET and rebuilt B trans(since I have a MK1, I'm trying to keep it simple as possible). So far, EVERYTHING bolted up, although the S14 bracket needed some modding.
Thanks for the comment guys. I've just been really focused on the S12, haven't been reading any comments or anything. At first I wanted to dump these Z rims but it just looks so nice now. I still need to source more parts before I get an alignment. I wanna make sure my suspension is done and I don't have to mess with it for a long while.
looks really good man!
awesome
Looking sweet man, how do the q45's feel? It's gonna be a bit until I actualyl get to use mine (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
Lol I can't drive it yet either. I'm waiting for MMR to send me the correct bushings. If I don't get them, I still need to get some stretched tires, lower the front, then alignment before I drive it. On top of that, I need gas. :-P Either way, it's gonna be a while here too haha.
Hahaha, I see. I really can't wait to feel the powerful two piston goodness that these q45's take for granted everyday (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shifty2.gif)
where did you get the 5x8 inch spring?
I got it at Pitstopusa.com. I kind of wish I got some 5x9.5" springs instead, cuz my car is WAYYYYY too low. At the time I couldn't find the 5x9.5" spring with the rate I wanted, but it's too late to exchange. All you need to do is find a store that sells performance springs or just find a spring manufacturer. Just look for retailers that stock AFCO or Blue Coil springs. I'm gonna keep trying to find other manufacturers.
Edit: Hypercoil also makes 5" OD springs. These 3 manufacturers have varying spring rates also. anywhere from 300-1500 in/lb springs. Certain lengths only come in certain rates.
I just got my 900lb 5x8 today and I'm pretty stoked. Hows your rear camber? And did you use stock rubber pads for the perches? I'm thinking about just squeezing in some heater hose at the ends of the springs
Damn, that'd be pretty stiff for street driving. My front is 6kg/mm, which is 336in/lbs and my rears are 350 in/lb. I hope these aren't too stiff for street driving and too soft for spirited driving. Let me know how that setup goes. Are any of you guys running the prothane spring seats with these springs? I'm thinking of getting those, but for the price, I'd rather just get a new set of springs and reuse my old rubber one or maybe using a 5" spring perch. I was thinking of welding it to my control arm so I can adjust height/corner weight it, but I might stick to getting springs in the length I want.
My rears are noticeably BAD. Somewhere around -3 to -4 degrees? I am using the stock rubber, well at least what's left of it. I still gotta put in the MMR subframe/diff bushing they sent me.
woo I did mine!!! PLENTY CAMBA!!! http://s80.photobucket.com/albums/j189/90mr2t/?start=100
Awesome Info man. Where did you find your vented lower control arms from the Z31? Im guessing a junkyard but sometimes people find them elsewhere. I cant find just two front s13 coilovers ANYWHERE, did you get yours from a forum?
Also im thinking about going with a 500-600lb spring in the rear, any one know the stiffness of that range?
You mean the wider rear lower control arms? They come off of any late model z31. As for coilovers, it's damn hard to find just the front pair. It's usually all or nothing. And what do you mean by "any one know the stiffness of that range?", 500-600lb is..500-600 lbs. Please be more specific, you could also do a lbs/in. to kg/mm conversion on google so you can compare those springs to any japanese/euro spring rates
I got my front setup from Nicoclub. My rears were from Z31performance forums. The vented arms are from the 87-89 Z31s.
Oh and new update, I just put in my S13 steering rack bushings on the driver side. The passenger side is too thin and it would make the rack uneven. Anyway, you'll need the S13 driver side steering rack bracket(its the egg shape) and the S13 ES steering rack bushings. It's going to be a tight fit and there will be a small gap when the bushing comes around, but with the S13 bracket, it'll work just perfect and add tension to the bushing. Cheap solution for 10 dollars. =) As for the passenger side, my stock one was still good, but OEM new or delrin would be nice.
The thing about the stock driver side is that it's already metal, the passenger side however is soft rubber. If anything the passenger side is the one that needs to get upgraded
That's true, but my stock driver side was crumbling apart when I replaced it. My steering feels much better now with less free play, although I didn't get to drive it due to it needing an alignment. My passenger side probably won't get replaced because I'm probably going to get a new rack in a few years anyway and it's most likely going to be the S13 one. Or I could just make aluminum S12 mounts since I planned that from the beginning, but that's probably going to be much later in my build.
what I meant by stiffnes was would it be a horrible daily driver because the rear end is so stiff.
I have a maxima on tein s-techs and they are bouncy as hell. I definetly want something more stiff for my s12
Ok, so I got my MMR subframe/diff bushings in. My stock ones were fine, but I decided to do it anyway. I should have filled it, oh well. I got the subframe out without dropping everything else. Now here are the pix
I got my MMR bushings after I sent the incorrect ones back. I'm planning on their passenger side rack bushings next. If that goes bad, I'm done with them haha. For those that want to save money/not deal with MMR, fill the mounts with windo-weld or poly roofing that Asparagus used, and grind the lip off the top to move the subframe closer to the chassis. Another solution would be to get the prothane Z31 bushings and shave it, like Asparagus did. If I didn't get these diff/subframe bushings, I would have filled them.
Here's where to grind, I just figured it out after I got my bushings out hah, but best of luck to those wanting to save money.
It's that little ridge at the top of the bushing, where metal part is.
Looks great man! I must admit the material used by MMR (which is delrin) is really desirable when you want stiffness, good shit :thumbsup
Hello. I wonder if you can fit this control arm on the stock s12 suspension?
its for the s13. Here
Yeah. It'll most likely work, but I can't guarantee it. A few years from now I hope to be using the Battle version front control arms, or something similar.
the LCA's wont fit unless you change everything tho convert the car to the S13 suspension.
Please note that in almost any country, the LCA is considered a structural member, and changing the factory item can lead to legal difficulties not seen when you just change castor rods and tie rods etc.
Also if you take the bushings out and go to a 4x4 or truck suspension dude, he will mill you poly replacements on the spot for about $15 each bush, including new crush tubes.
If you ask nicely he will press the old ones out of the arms and put the new ones in for nothing.
One last thing, whats up with you guys going for stiffer springs in the rear than in the front?
I'm sure theres some kind of good reason, but in every well set up car I've ever seen, the stiffer springs are in the front, and the lighter ones in the back.
I'm guessing the idea is to make the car oversteer more, but using the bumps and springs to get some oversteer jut seems weird to me.
comments?
We need stiffer springs in the rear to compensate for our rear trailing arm design, you can read the discussion in the "final solution" thread in the suspension forum. In the "well set up" cars you've seen, their rear suspension design/geometry is probably very different from our own.
Aaaah, yes, you guys commonly had the IRS version, I keep forgetting...
Normal cars have weaker rear springs, anyway
Alright new stuff! GOODIES!
I have up to 3 inches of height adjustment with these.
For those wondering about going lower than Henry's car(8 inch length spring), you can use these perches(+/- 3" of adjustment) and the 5x4 springs to go super low. Just don't complain about camber.
So there you have it, the alternative to MR coils AND I solved the rear end height adjustment problems for the S12s/Z31 guys.
The only thing I've modified on my car was the S14 tension rod brackets(one hole). My goal is to find parts to make it fit to OEM stuff. That way I'm finding stuff to use with OEM shit, not making OEM shit fit to random parts. I just don't want to cut anything I don't need to.
What size spring are you using in the back with SS-85500, Width, I,D? How long have you been riding on them? Do they keep their adjustment? I like how you found a Dirt track place! I love them they always have cheap solutions to car set up problems. DirtTrack is pretty much the staple of NorthAmerican racing, and to keep it so average joe can compeat stuffs always real cheap.
Can I use that type of spring perch on my solid rear axel?
My spring is 5 inches wide by 8 inches. I just got these so I don't know about holding the adjustment but it should be fine, it's only moving up and down. They do feel a lot better without the rubber isolators and when I jump on the back, it doesn't give me excessive amounts of movement.
I don't think these will fit the solid rear axle. I want to find someone local to measure it and everything but nobody so far has posted any pictures or measurements for me. I know it's scattered on these boards and I'd have to look around before I can tell you for sure. I want to know what the solid rear axle underbody looks like, as well as the shock mounts, ID and OD of the spring seat etc.
I got 350 because it's 6kg, and most coilovers run 8/6 rates, so that way I don't have to buy new springs or whatnot if I adapt S13 coils or anything. My front coils are absolute crap, I kind of regret getting these HAs, but oh well, at least my car is rolling. I'm thinking of S13 Endura-tech coils, or maybe KTS next, but that's gonna be after a long while, since I'm planning a 5-speed and r200 first.
Anyway, for a little review. These Q35/J30 brakes feel freaking awesome. It's super responsive and brakes when I actually want to. I'm too scared to drive econo boxes now since I don't know when it'll actually stop!! hahah. The car itself is pretty nice just driving around. It's just a little stiff, but it's not retarded annoying and I actually like it. The rear end doesn't squat as much since I got rid of those rubber isolators(and back end actually feels responsive even though it's a CA20 LOL). I still need a little more parts here and there but I think I'll mess with my suspension after I go 5-speed/r200 and CA18DET.
when you replaced those main bushings allot of your squat was minimized?
considering that those bushing have allot of play to bengine with.
Yeah, those stock spring isolator mounts gave me a LOT of play. Now it feels stiff. Maybe with a real coilover shock it'll feel a lot firmer, but these AGXes are fine for now. I'm not going to complain about them. Hell, I don't think I can complain about squatting with a CA20 anyway, since there isn't enough power to affect it. =P
Honestly, all I'll probably need left for my rear suspension is to make my monoball bushings, adapt S13 coilovers, keep the right height reasonable and I'll be fine. I won't be able to scrape frame rails, but that's fine at the expense of better handling.
I think I'm gonna copy your rear spring set up! The 5" spring sits ok in the chassis side of the car, the top half. The spring has no vertical movement there? I only ask cause I remember the stock springs being pig tail types. Also that lower adjustible spiring seat; It's steel? I could weld it to my suspension arm?
Yep, it's steel. My friend wanted me to tack it, but I didn't feel it was necessary. The top part doesn't move all crazy as far as I know. I clipped the dirt on an S turn and jumped the whole right side. I checked it again and everything looks fine. Alignment feels the same. =/ Anyway, I don't think it makes a big deal on the top part, since the arm is at an angle as it travels, a little movement should be fine. I was more worried about the arm side moving around, but that's not a problem anymore. If you go super low, just make sure you get short stroked shocks.
Oh and if you guys are worried about it moving, get 5" springs with one end pigtailed. I haven't had any issues though, but that's all up to you guys. Just make sure you get the right length shock if you go lower than an 5x8" spring.
