Nebuchernezzer - Engineer needed!

Hey neby :D

My workshop in hornsby said that my coilovers and tie rod adapters arent exactly legal, so they may be hard to engineer approve depending on the engineer.
My question to you is who did you use for an engineer and did you have any probs with your suspension? What didnt pass and how did you get it to pass!

Im very close to getting back on the road now and I need to make sure I aint held back by the RTA or engineer.

Thanks mate!

I used Athol Mullen in Cardiff in Newcastle, great bloke who knows his stuff. Coilovers and tie rod ends were no probs, just got em engineered when i got everything else done, he just looked at them, judged them to be all good engineering wise and got on with it. The only things i had to change when i did my car was to move my boost guage about 2" lower on the A pillar and to put mesh in front of the intercooler (which i was gonna do anyways) due to some dumb cops around the place judging that a cooler is sharp and a hazard to pedestrians. He thought it was dumb too but thats life. Basically your car should pass fine as long as it retains all the factory emmissions gear (EGR etc), a factory type airbox (i used a VL commo one before i replaced it with a pod), factory ECU, more than 100mm mimimum clearance to everything including the exhaust (he slides a 100mm block under the car to check). You also need a noise test showing less than 90db at 3/4 redline (i got it done to the S12's dash redline not the SR20DET's redline hehehe) and a weighbridge ticket for the car. I'm not sure what he'd think of the S15 turbo but just don't mention it and it'll be fine :), it might not pass cos it'd change emmisions.
He's a helpfull guy, he'll probably want to tell you about his 302 powered volvo 244 with bilstein struts or his twin turbo toyota crown project or the worst cars he's ever had come in for engineering or whatnot :)

Wow so like an actual engineer inspects you guy's cars? :wtf: F'in christ man most of the states don't even look under the car.

Yeah it's a requirement for cars with more than a certain level of modification, on our cases with non standard engines suspension etc etc it's a good idea. If i just did the suspension i probably wouldn't bother but technically it would be illegal then, any mods to standard technically should be engineered but people only actually do it when they are big mods.

What sort of engineer do you need to sign off on things? Are these mechanical engineers? Must they hold the equivalent of a PE (Professional Engineer) license like you have in the US if you want to use the title "engineer"? Or is "engineer" a title you give to an experienced mechanic or something?
In good ole' South Carolina, I don't think anyone in the government EVER looks at anyone's car, mechanically speaking. I could probably put my Nissan's VIN plate in a Ferrari and no one would ever know the better...well, until I got pulled over and get asked, "license and registration, please"... The only trouble I've ever seen people get in with the police with mechanical condition has been either missing headlights or open exhaust (noise rules in some towns).

Defecting is kind of a cop sport or somthing around here :P
Most common is 'to loud to low' but they can slap a defect on anyone (deserving or not) and let the roads and traffic authority decide weather you are actually in breach of any laws, of course you have to pay $60 and can't drive your car either or somthing like that.
The engineers in question are qualified motor engineers (whatever they are, i guess some mech eng background), i remember seeing all the qualifications hanging on the guys wall. As far as i know it's not an easy field to get into, and not a large one either.

I sure hope nothing like that comes to the states cuz I will fight that with every fiber of my being...

i had a much longer rant but decided to put it elsewhere

i will be one of those automotive engineers soon.........you gotta do the last 2 years with automotive based subjects to become an one.

Then i can write all ma mates cars as legal! yay

Thanks neb.

POD, Exhaust sound and emissions are gonna be a prob. GOnna have to to sacrifice some power on the dyno to make sure emissions are fine :dontknow:

Ill use the workshops engineer then if he doesnt like the adapters and coils ill goto your guy! Expensive stuff!

Yeah well most ppl i know jam a factory nissan airbox of some kind in just for engineers, exhaust on my car wasn't that loud a relatively simple restrictor fixed it, so would jamming a small restrictive muffler on just for the test, emmissions isn't a test, they just look and go hmm looks standard, mine was standard but i have no EGR now cos the extractor manifold gets in the way. It's only a problem if you get defected, but you always undo your changes to get the defect lifted. Oh yeah atmo BOVs are illegal in case you didn't know, i used a hybrid plumback with the atmo side capped, passed no probs :)

I sure hope nothing like that comes to the states cuz I will fight that with every fiber of my being...

i had a much longer rant but decided to put it elsewhere
I seriously hope that something like that DOES come to the states. I see dumbasses every day in Honda's with cut springs and dead shocks riding on the bumpstops. They go over the smallest of bumps and the car will bounce 4 or 5 times before settling. That's just dangerous to themselves and everyone around them. I'd gladly let any engineer look over my car to make sure that everything is safe, because I know it is. At least that way, you wouldn't see as many idiots around!

Neb, I know you don't write the laws, but why on earth would an atmospheric BOV be illegal? It's only blowing off fresh air? I find that a bit odd.

Neb, I know you don't write the laws, but why on earth would an atmospheric BOV be illegal? It's only blowing off fresh air? I find that a bit odd.

That's exactly the reason I'd fight it to the death. It's illegal because some moron thought it should be. Here's the reasons it could possibly be illegal

1. It's illegal merely becuase it is (the people who wrote the law didn't know what it was) 99% this is the cause of stupid emission laws.

2. Becuase some environmentalists said this could cause the apocalypse.

People have the right to be complete idiots whether you like it or not. They always have and they always will. Having some engineer look over your car isn't going to prevent something from breaking and maiming someone. The best you can hope for is that they run into a tree and die without hurting anything else

It can reduce how often that happens but at what cost? So some person who, god forbid, might know what was he's ****ing doing HAVE to pay for someone to inspect his car anyway and then get hassled over something as mundane as an atmospheric BOV.

There are ways around stupid crap like this too. Like if you know somebody maybe or pay the guy on the side. It just doesn't work!!! Why waste my goddamn money on something that can be bypassed just as easily a wire.

edit: yes I know we have inspections and all but they're not NEARLY as intensive. Cars should never have to be inspected to begin with !

OH YEAH!! BTW I'd gladly let any engineer look over my car to make sure that everything is safe, because I know it is. At least that way, you wouldn't see as many idiots around!
An engineer looking at someone's car and nagging about their intercooler "shredding a pedestrian" (like you actually supposed to hit one) isn't going to change how intelligent a person is. They're still going to be a dumbass and, unless they're a paraplegic, they're still gonna be running around too.

LOL Okay - I can see you feel very strongly about this. You are right that the whole system would probably be corrupt and it wouldn't change a dang thing except raise the price of the priveledge of driving. I don't even have smog testing where I live (thank goodness because all my cats ran away). I can live without the engineer thing, but I would really like to see more stringent licensing tests, similar to those in Europe (Germany mostly). I can't believe how many people are allowed to drive on public roads who have absolutely no right to be there. This could be an incredibly long post if I ranted and raved about all the idiots out there though, so I'll just leave it at that. And I will add that everyone is guilty of idiocy behind the wheel at some point, even me. LOL

the penalty for stupidity should be like it was in the old days.

Instant death... Stick a fork in an electrical socket? The power company should use 12,000 volts AC so that the dude get's fried faster the colonels original recipe.

That is all

I can live without the engineer thing, but I would really like to see more stringent licensing tests, similar to those in Europe (Germany mostly). I can't believe how many people are allowed to drive on public roads who have absolutely no right to be there.
well i'm german,. and so is my dad, and he would always tell me stories about how everything is so much stricter there.. i dont know how up to date all this is but he would tell me about how in the 70's and 80's it cost about $3000 to get your driver's license, also.. in order to get it, you had to know general maintenance such has changing the oil and being able to check all the fluids and such. also, in order to pass inspection everything had to be stock.. he was just telling me the other day how he used to have an Audi 80 and he took the front skirt off an upgraded model (like the turbo's and SE's have on our cars) and the guy wouldnt let him pass since it didnt come stock on that car, even though it was a factory part and wasnt anything aftermarket..

now like i said.. i dont know how much of that is still current,.. but i know i wouldnt want anything like that here..

Right - I was just talking about licensing only. Although, the general car maintenance knowledge would be a good thing too. Anyway, we're waaaay off topic here, so I'm going to hand it back to anybody who wants to respond to the original post. LOL

Neb, I know you don't write the laws, but why on earth would an atmospheric BOV be illegal? It's only blowing off fresh air? I find that a bit odd.
It's not the actualy BOV itself thats making the emmissions but the rich spike it causes on gearchanges due to venting some air that the AFM already meaasured.
Having said that it's not illegal in every state of australia (it's also common in my state, i have a hybrid that vents both plumb back and atmospheric), pod filters are also legal in some states as well. If your car is older than 1974 you can do whatever you like due to there being no emmissions laws for before that year (it's the same as with old cars and seatbelts, but everyone has them anyways). That's why the engineer i went to is using a 1969 toyota crown as the basis for his twin turbo V8, he also wants to use a late model shell on it possibly from something boring like a magna (diamonte to you i thinkg) or a camry though it's technically still a crown cos of the chassis and can get around all emmissions laws. Partly due to having an open slather on cars older than 1974 the most popular street drag cars are stuff like RX3s with 13B turbos, datsun 1600s with SR20DET or FJ20DET conversions, datsun 1200s with CA18DETs etc. They can go crazy with mods and aftermarket ECU etc and not have to worry about getting defected (although the cops will probably try anyways).

You know, I thought about the rich environment that an atmospheric BOV creates, but it's for such a brief moment, I'm surprised anyone cares. That's government for you though. Oh well - my motto is, "It's only illegal if you get caught". ;-)

Heh.. yeh my workshops engineer will pass an atmo bov and pod! Still dont mean cops will allow it tho :rofl:

Ill get me POd and bov passed with my mechanics engineer, then pass my coils and adapters with your engineer :mrgreen:

Sigh.. i just hope i pass and I start drifting!

Bear in mind that will cost you for two engineers certificates, ie around $600 :|, it might be easier to return to stock suspension. Also on that note my mates SR20DET S12 passed with a pod and no EGR as well, i think the local guy here wouldn't do it, he's pretty much by the book to save himself any hassles.

That's government for you though. Oh well - my motto is, "It's only illegal if you get caught"
Yea that is so true, as long as you don't get caught out by a blitz or always drive where there are cops looking for defects (ie the foreshore down here in newcastle) you are sweet. There are many silvias, skylines, soarers etc around here, some making big power and you can garentee that most of them are running pod, atmo BOV, 3" zaust that is prolly over 90dB and are prolly to low. My mates 4AGZE powered AE82 corolla makes something like 110dB when you hit the loud pedal :|...

Seeing as your mate got tmb car engineered he must have also got the coils done too right? I might just use your mates engineer! You wouldnt have his contact details would you? ;-)

EDIT: I also think i may get my mechanic to fab me up a nice POD partition and make it look enclosed but still get a good amount of fresh air!! :rofl:

Nah TMB engineered the car before he sold it, maybe through a mate of his or somthing, it got the pod engineered which is usually a no go, it was also engineered for a BOV which it doesn't have and stuff like that, it was a plumback BOV that was written on the papers. No engineer should have any trouble with the suspension though, it's not a big deal why won't the guy do it?

Well I dont exactly know if he will do it or not, just my mechanic was a bit worried it may not pass.

I just dont want to spend $300-500 on an engineer for him to say he cant pass it cause hes too tight ass :-P

I hope all goes smooth.... ive waited too long for this to be stuffed around now :neutral:

Talk to the engineer first, he'll tell you what will and won't pass beforehand, i only paid the cash after the car had actually passed on it's second inspection.

Not a bad idea!

Ill get onto him 2day if i can! Heh while im at it ill ask them to make an eclosure for my POD http://www.club-s12.org/board/images/smilie/pimpflash.gif

just to let some of yous know, atmo bovs are illegal for a few reasons, like the rich running for very short time, AND there is a tiny ammount of oil in the compressed air from the turbo's bearings, if you vent your atmo bov into a filter, then it is legal, funny huh? as long as its not above the pre-determined dB limit. But if you ask me its all a crok of sh1t, so just dont go venting ya bov infront of the boys in blue and you will be fine...........oh and pods are legal in an airbox................so cut a hole in the bottom of the box!

In queensland you dont need a rego inspection every year ,only if the car is reregistered by a new owner or if its been transfered from another state or unregistered for a certain amount of time.
If the car is modified in anyway you need a modplate wich lists all modifications and is issued the same way as a pink slip in new south wales.

Queensland is pretty lax, you can rego any old heap of crap, or keep any old heap of crap registered provided it never changes hands. NSW is the toughest all round as usual :(

getting my car pressure and compression tested. Dont know if they are the same thing but im getting two tests done on my engine.

Mechanic said that compression testing isnt reliable due to different cams and the amount of times the engine is cranked over, all contributing to different readings which means they cant me compared with any other engine/car. So he said he would do the other test as well. Other test is where he shoves compressed air into the cylinder, then measures the loss.

As you can see i have nfi but ill post the numbers! :slap:

Leak down test i imagine, got an ETA on your car yet? I have some suspension bits i want to get in this week (castor rods i had machined down 20mm, strut brace, engine damper, cradle bush caps) lots of things to get in the car.

Do you have a strut brace already? If not Ill get one with ya!!

Currently my car has got the front pipe, oil pressure guage, cooler piping, oil cooler hoses and brake lines to be fitted. They are busy so probably finish end of this week or early next.

I got my driving gloves and harness the other day too!! :kicknuts:

After that its dyno tune time then engineer then rego. Im trying to get the car ready ASAP for the UAS track day!

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Also the results of the testing: 150--150-135-150
Mechanic will do another test when car is full of oil and running properly.

I actually expected better results seeing how well my car went last track day! :lame:

Yeah do it when it's running and see if that one cylinder is still down on the others. I already got a cheap strut brace ment for a S13/S14/S15. $89 from JustJap but i got to modify it a bit to fit.
How much and what brand were the gloves? I think they will be a must for summer track days

Yeah do it when it's running and see if that one cylinder is still down on the others. I already got a cheap strut brace ment for a S13/S14/S15. $89 from JustJap but i got to modify it a bit to fit.
How much and what brand were the gloves? I think they will be a must for summer track days
Yeh my gloves are actually alot better than i first thought. Grips the wheel like a monkey to a tree 8-)
Gloves are F1-T blue
http://www.revolutionracegear.com.au/RacegearAccessories/images/ProductEnlargedImage-417C601F-65BF-DC98-E5E4EF37E26A67F9.jpg

Got them from revolution racegear! thanks neb 8-)

Ah alpinestars are a good brand, how much were they? And more importantly will you have trouble letting the wheel slip through your hands for those full counter moments.

Gloves aint cheap $199.

I too was wondering if the wheel can free spin with the gloves on and basically its fine. If anything you can more accuratly stop the wheel when its spinning than you can with sweaty hands or shot nerves ehhe :lol: Also gives you a better sense of control too.

Plus my car doesnt have power steer to more grip on the wheel the better :D

Im now looking for some nice lgiht casual/running shoes to use as driving shoes!!

On another note...... My rims hit my coilovers, so I bought a 8mm spacer. Now my mechanic is saying i need to have longer wheel studs and my guard rolled a bit to fit the rims.. Man this project is costing more and more! Rego may be delayed now

If the engineer notices the spacer it won't pass, only bolt on spacers (known as adoptors instead apparently) are legal in nsw, the slip on type aren't. Doesn't mean that people don't use them all the time thought. Hmm gloves are expensive, i was hoping they were more in line with the cost of my old downhill mountain biking gloves and such :(
I have a pair of Quicksilver boat shoe type things that are really nice to drive in, dead flat and fairly soft soles. Cost me $15 from a factory outlet in the Gold Coast a month or two ago.

Yeh the tyre rubbing is easily fixed with the camber setting on the coilover hub bolt. Ill use the spacers after engineering.

Do or did you have any issues with the tyre hitting the coils?
Do your coilovers have an adjustment for the hub as well as the strut top?

Nah i only have the preload adjust on mine, it scrubs a little on the guard lips (i have never noticed so, it must be during very hard cornering). Also i scrub a little on the inner guard plastic shields now that i have put my castor rods in :), i reckon i have about 2.5degrees extra castor now, i'll tell you for sure after i get some new front tyres and a wheel alignment. I have heaps of clearance to the struts, i had some 8s on the front and they juuuust cleared but the 7s are fine.