Thinking about buying used turbo

Well, after doing a little ebay shopping, I found a good deal on a t3 (no internal wastegate) with a .45 a/r. This seems a little on the small side to me, but what do you guys think? This will be going on my hybrid project CA20ET, think it'll be enough to support 250-275 rwhp (that's my goal anyway)? Or should I go ahead get a t3/t4? Or should I screw all this used parts shopping and buy a new one? :dontknow:

I'm trying to keep this project on a fairly tight budget so I can finish it sometime this century... :mrgreen: So far I've been proud of myself, I'm stockpiling parts already, and haven't spent over $50 at a time... :mrgreen:

hahah. buying turbos on ebay.....that arent new. I would say just spend the extra $$ on this get a NEW turbo. Not a rebuit if possible. Everyone on ebay claims "little shaft play" but when yo uactually get it, its on the point of blowing an o-ring.

I say this because of experience with tards who sell stuff on ebay. When I sold my turbo, i sold it as BROKEN. EXCESSIVE SHAFT PLAY. Warn out shaft.

Most people just take them off their cars and say: ye, it still spins.... a little. Its sellable. and guess who gets a crappy turbo for a "bargain".

Just my 2 cents.

Well, I'm not afraid of having to rebuild it if it's a good price. There's not much to rebuilding a turbo, as long as the shaft or housing isn't scored up... But thanks for the input. If I can get this one I'm looking at, I won't lose too much even if it's not useable... :laugh:

what do you think is the reason for a turbo needing to be "rebuilt"

1) Oil o-rings blow (minor fix)
2) Center bearing getting messed up. (another semi easy cheap fix if shft isnt screwed)
3) Center shaft getting screwed due to debris or oil starvation. Yes, some ppl cant hook up turbos.

My old turbo (Garrett T25) was able to have a max of .009 play in the shaft for it to be able to "run".

I had .018 removed from the shaft because of the tard who had it on the car before. It got all this dirt into the center and then later into the oil. Good thing the magnetic drain plug caught most of it. I found this out when i filtered my oil that I drained before the rebuild. Found the same inside the turbo.

Just get a new or a like new rebuild. It will save you possible grief later on. You can get GOOD deals on ebay, so dont worry.

I got mine on ebay and it was perfectly fine. The only real problem with it was the downpipe was pretty badly made and the O2 sensors wiring was hacked up (I needed a new one anyways)

You could almost buy an engine for as much as a new turbo costs. :dontknow: Whatever suits you I guess

TD05-16G

:twisted:

TD05-16G

:twisted:
hell ya matt and make it with a wastegate dump tp atmoshpere.. that would sound so sick

heh, yeah they sound amazing ... but sound aside, a big or even small 16G will make a T2/3 look like a hair dryer.

Good reconned small 16s go for about $500 cdn around here ... $650+ for the big 16.

Oh, and the kit to turn your 14B into a small 16 is about $100.

Used 14Bs (which will outflow T28s and a lot of T3s) go for about $100 for a used one.

If that's not enough to send your conrods into recyled metal heaven, grab the 20G :twisted:

Well, I'm bidding on a brand new t3/t4 hybrid right now, and it's at $167.50... :laugh: He's got three of them for sale, with two at $167, and one at $150, so maybe it won't go up too much. Bad part is I'm not gonna be able to watch it at the end of bidding (it ends at like 2:00 am Friday morning), so I probably will end up getting the shaft... :wall:

heh, yeah they sound amazing ... but sound aside, a big or even small 16G will make a T2/3 look like a hair dryer.

Good reconned small 16s go for about $500 cdn around here ... $650+ for the big 16.

Oh, and the kit to turn your 14B into a small 16 is about $100.

Used 14Bs (which will outflow T28s and a lot of T3s) go for about $100 for a used one.

If that's not enough to send your conrods into recyled metal heaven, grab the 20G :twisted:

ya i know the mitsu turbos are sweet but you will need alot more fabrication to get them to fit, thats why the t-series are so much easier for us to use...

The 14b should outflow the smaller T3s, however it won't outflow a 60trim T3 or a t28 (as it uses a 60 trim t3 compressor). It does flow very close to both of these turbos however and can be picked up much more cheaply than a t28.

Compressor maps of those turbos can be found here, http://www.stealth316.com/2-3s-compflowmaps.htm#fm

true ... the numbers are very close, but beyond that, ported 14Bs with a bigger exhasut housing and wastegate are also available cheap ;)

And the fabrication involved is no different than what you'd need to go to a T3 or any other non-T2 flange.

You'd have no business putting a big turbo on the factory cast manifold anyway.

When people are paying upwards of $1,000 for a new T28, a rebuilt small 16 and a custom manifold would still cost less and flow more :twisted:

But I'm biased

true ... the numbers are very close, but beyond that, ported 14Bs with a bigger exhasut housing and wastegate are also available cheap ;)

And the fabrication involved is no different than what you'd need to go to a T3 or any other non-T2 flange.

You'd have no business putting a big turbo on the factory cast manifold anyway.

When people are paying upwards of $1,000 for a new T28, a rebuilt small 16 and a custom manifold would still cost less and flow more :twisted:

But I'm biased

well going from round to rectangle isnt that straight forward as welding a t3 flange on the stock mani, but ya it should be going on a custom turbo header....thats why after i use my t28 for a while(picked t up for only 150 with 22k on it) i want to use the stock td50h.i think. its the stock turbo off the new evo 8 sucker has supported over 400hp.. ball bearing and twin scroll

you could buy a CA18DET front clip for around a 1000 (shipping's extra but still) and as a conselation prize you get a turbo with it! AMAZING!!!

These turbos intrigue me... perhaps I should a new manifold made.... BAh! I just got done screwing around with the turbo and I'm happy as a clam right now.

Power is addicting... it's been 3 weeks after I got the T25 on and i already want to boost it to 14-15 and see what it'll run. But i need a clutch first :cry:

Johnnyfiveyou could buy a CA18DET front clip for around a 1000 (shipping's extra but still) and as a conselation prize you get a turbo with it! AMAZING!!!

QUOTE]

the prob is that the t25 off the ca18det is barely bigger then the t2 we have stock..

But it comes with the engine hence it's like getting the piece of chewing gum with the baseball card you didn't buy the card for the gum you wanted the card. So you sell that turbo on ebay and then get a real good one.

i got mine for about 227 I'd figure that's a teensy bit high so maybe a median selling price of 175-200 and viola you can put more money toward mods.

The only real reason we even screw around with these 10-15 year old design turbos is because they're cheap and readily available. one_equals_two setup cost him about a grand total. His turbo spools just fine and he has a stock manifold. Mine spools only a tad quicker and I think it's almost instant as it is. I don't remember where he got his but you can get an identical one off a Turbo thunderbird. u-pull-its charge about 50 bucks for them. That and he might need internal work to go even faster so it's about as far as you can go anyways as far as air

His car probably has almost if not more power than yours. He'll soon find out :mrgreen:. He didn't need a 1000 dollar turbo to do it either. In fact he spent less than i did. Although my exhaust was the real ball breaker of my setup I still outspent him by 300 dollars minus the exhaust.

eh oh well whatever works and well

My t3 came used from a Merkur Xr4ti. It was bought on eBay. It's the same Ford 2.3 you'll find in the T-bird or SVO Mustang as well. It was a 60 trim t3 with the .63 A/R housing. I'll make a nice write up on it once I get my pictures put together. There is a lot of work to putting a t3 on, but me and Mr Bob are thinking of making kits that will include everything except the turbo if there is interest. A 14b will take a lot of work on the exhaust side of things too, but depending on how big the compressor is, you may also have to switch engine mounts. The T3 doesn't not clear the stock motor mount when using the stock manifold.

The 14Bs are great turbos, and you can't beat the price you can get them for on eBay or dsm trader. From what I read, it can be tough to find a 14b without some cracks in the turbine housing though. If someone wants to pick one up with a cracked exhaust housing, I can probably hook them up with the housing off my Starion turbo for just the cost of shippnig. They are both TD05s, so I'm pretty sure they would bolt up, but one of the DSM guys would be better to ask for sure on that.

I paid $300 for my turbo, but you can pick up these turbos all day long for less. A TD05-14B will run about $100 for one in good shape. For the same price as a t-25, it would be an awesome turbo if you don't mind some fabrication. A t-25 would be better if you just want a bolt on turbo though.

As for the A/R, you might want to stick with a .48 or so housing. The .63 will spool up by 3k rpms, but it doesn't pull really hard until 4k. The .48 would be better on the street, but the .63 will be better at a track. Keep in mind that with no internal wastegate, you will have to make a new manifold. There's not nearly as much room on that side of the engine bay as it first looks like. Here is the t3 sitting in the engine bay...

http://www.one-equals-two.net/posted/turbo-small.jpg

Hopefully I can get a chance to get it up on the dyno again and find out how much power it's putting down. I'd say that really close to 200hp at the wheels wouldn't be far off. I'll let you guys when I put a hole in my block... I'd like to get it to a 1/4 mile track, I'm pretty sure I could hit 13s with a good launch, but the closest ones are 2-3 hours away. I might hit up the 1/8 mile here soon though.

One other thing I forgot to mention, with the t3 set to about 13 psi, the S-AFC shows that my MAF sensor is at 95% of the max it can read at redline. This means that if you decide to go to a t4 compressor, you will definitely need to upgrade your MAF sensor.

Did you have that oil line for the turbo at the meet? I don't remember seeing that. Where did you get it from (or how did you make it ;) )? Like I said mine didn't seem too bad i also checked to see if it was clogged (hence my T2 being seized when I got it). But I would like to look into that before it's too late

Do you have full boost by 3k or does it just get going? Mine will produce boost at like 1500 have a minimum of 6psi by 2K and by 2500 it's at my high boost setting of 12.7 psi (up from a consistent 10 from when i was at dragon) and pulling like a mad man (or slipping my clutch depnding on how hot the clutch lines are). Maybe it's my boost controller I thought you said you were going to put one on?

The reason i went with a T25 was simple. My T2 was seized I heard it sucked why fix it or get another one? There were a few on ebay so I could just buy one. I didn't even think about a T3 then. All I wanted was to experience boost (which was why I bought the car to begin with). In fact i still the T2 off my car.

And it gave me the chance to do all of these at the same time... bigger turbo, BOV, Intercooler, I/C piping, awesome exhaust and I'd sprinkle it with some guages (good ones) and an elec. boost controller and turbo timer. This car's my daily driver anyways and I usually don't drive like a maniac anyways. I don't even know who the stupid thing feels from the factory cause i didn't to drive it with the stock equipment. :laugh:

Yeah, I had it on there at the meet, it was just hidden around all the rest of the intake stuff. It's made of 2 feet of AN line and a handful of AN fittings. You can find all of this at Summit Racing. It's kind of pricey though, really, it costs more than my entire exhaust system (should be about $50 or so for all the fittings).

I do have the boost controller on. The RX-7 wastegate I'm using only runs about 6 psi, and the turbo sucks at anything less than 10psi. I've got mine at about 13psi now, it still spikes to 14psi first. The other boost controller I was talking about was the electronic one me and Mr Bob made. We haven't ever got around to putting it on, but we did test it and it appears to work.

I can make about 8 psi by 2800 or so rpms. The turbo doesn't really spool until past 8psi, then it rockets up to whatever you set it to. Actually, at 8psi on the t3, it doesn't pull as hard as 14psi on the t2. Once you cross 8psi though, it pulls like crazy. At 3,000 rpms it crosses over the point where the turbo starts to become effecient so it starts to ramp up in power at 3k, it probably hits its spike around 3300-3500 and is completely setting by about 3600-3800. Once it settles the computer finally acts right and the car runs good, right about 4K. I'll try to get some video soon of all the gauges and hopefully the G-Tech soon. Then everyone can see how it spools and runs with all the data available and decide for themselves.

I thought it spooled better when we were at the Gap because I had only driven it like 20 minutes of WOT runs for tuning, and the really long interstate drive (which is at 3.5k-4K rpms the whole way). Now that I've had a chance to drive it around in my stupid town with it's 30mph limits I can tell it spools later. It's a lot more progressive when coming up on boost though, so it's really nice at a track, plus it's not hard to stay at 3k+ on a track, but in town 2K is where I like to keep the engine. My S12 is only really driven on a track, curvy roads, or when my other car is out of gas, so around town stuff doesn't matter too much to me. Also, the turbo would rock when I finally get the money to put my DOHC head on.

** Back to the actual topic **
I would imagine there are a lot of t25s on eBay in good shape since a lot of guys pull them off their cars when upgrading to a bigger turbo. The t25 is incredibly easy to find and bolts right up (although you might need some exhaust work done). Me and my friends have bought about 6 second hand turbos in the past year or so, and all have been in good shape so far. When buying a turbo that has been sitting for a while you will have more play in the shaft since it doesn't have the layer of oil in there to keep everything tight. Try it on your t2, take it off and feel how much play it has, then let it sit for a week and see how much play it develops. My t3 had a bit of play before I put it on, but once some oil got to it, it all disappeared.

Wow, I almost bought the smaller .48 T3 on ebay. That looks pretty awesome in there... :D I think I might try a T3 just to get it running, that way if I ever did want to upgrade, it'd be an easy swap for a T3/T4. Definetly get us a write up on what all you did for that! ;)

the 14B fits in the stock location ... it is a bit of a nightmare to get it to fit though. Again, I'm still in the process ...

I'd like to know how your adapter plate works ... I was going to try something similar, but the design I had hit the mount. But yours looks like a better alternative. I had a double sort of sandwich plate, but the bolts wouldn't clear the stupid manifold.

So, the 14B will fit, one of 2 ways. I'm trying one, and if it works or doesn't, I've got one more up my sleeve.

this is the 14B next to the T2

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/mr200/200sx/14bvs.jpg