Lowering Springs FOR the S12!!

okay guys, thanks to Matt(Mr. 200) for making initial contact, we can FINALLY have springs that are made FOR the S12.

http://www.canuckmotorsports.com

these guys are located in my city, and I've contacted them about using my car to take measurements and I'll be making an appointment next week to bring my car in.

for the springs, it was discussed that a good drop would be either 2" drop front and rear, or 1" in the front and 2" in the rear.

and as for spring rates it was suggested 325-350lb front and 275-300 rear.

I wanna get your guys' input on rates and drop amount before I go in so we can get these made up pretty quickly.

the general quote is $100 - $124CDN for a set of FOUR!!!

I'm always throwing around the idea of having them make some camber correction hardware. probably camber tops for the frong, but not sure about the rear.

anyways, I WILL be bringing in my car either way. just need people's input on drop and spring rate and possibly any other concerns we should bring up.

please keep in mind that they'll be taking measurements off a ca20e. however, the springs may have sagged by now..so it may be good to have the actual specs too.

here's the info I found on them...
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?p=3116020
http://www.torontomaxima.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4165
http://www.torontomaxima.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3984

okay guys, thanks to Matt(Mr. 200)

Just where in the heck has he been lately anyway???

2" drop front and rear

That's got my vote... :mrgreen:

Awesome pricing too!!! I'll definetly be buying a set, and if they make camber plates or a kit for the rear, I'll buy that too!

As far as the rates go, doesn't that seem a little soft in the front? I'm pretty clueless on street cars though, since I ran 1000 lbs springs in my race car... :laugh:

just make sure that no one forgets about us VG guys,.. maybe we can find something right in the middle that would be beneficial to all S12's

You'll want to lower the front more than the rear. The rear can't be lowered too much without causing severe camber changes. For example I have Tokicos old lower springs that advertise a 1 inch drop and that brings the rear camber to 3 degrees. You probably wouldn't want any more than that.

^^^ that's why I'll be talking to them about camber correction

Just where in the heck has he been lately anyway???
According to Mr.Furious, Matt's internet at work is really messed up, and therefore he is hardly ever on...I am hoping that they get it resolved fairly soon...

back to the topic at hand boys and..err..boys..ahha

spring rates and lowering amount? any specs for stock equipment?

OK I'm goin off what I had to go through when I found My hypercoils. This is only for the rear and I had a VG when I did it.

The rear springs are 14" tall. I tested with 12" and 10".

Springs I tested:

12" 250: Not worth it

12" 325: Too high and not stiff enough.

10" 325: Not stiff enough for me. Remember I built it for drifting so I went higher, this may be a good choice.

12" 350: Not too much difference between this and 325lbs

12" 450: WAY too high. While the springs are 2" shorter they are no longer progressive springs. THis means that they will not compress as much when you put down the full weight of the car. In the end the rear and get JACKED UP and you ride Dukes of Hazard style.

10" 500: This is what I ended up choosing. It still leave about a 3.5" gap between the fender and the tire but I wanted something really stiff. You could go with something like a 350 and its should leave it a little lower than mine.

So things to remember when testing springs. Our springs are progressive so they will give more when you put down all the weight than the ones you are testing. Unless you also are using progressive springs. The other type better though.(forgot what it was called) Also if using non-progressive spring you'll have to find the righ balance of spring height and rate to give you ride height. Becasue you may choos a shorter spring but if its rate is too high it'll jack the car up more than stock.

I ended up goin with the 10" 500lb Hypercoils and they work out really well. But there are downsides. Since the spring is so much shorter I have to reseat the spring everytime I jack up the rear of the car. It doesn't take toolong but it gets me funny looks when I'm at drifiting events. :) Also the bottome nipple that the spring sits on had to be bashed in to properly sit the new springs. because the hypercoils ate 2.5" diameter.

Ok, I'm tired of typing now.... :)

You'll want to lower the front more than the rear. The rear can't be lowered too much without causing severe camber changes. For example I have Tokicos old lower springs that advertise a 1 inch drop and that brings the rear camber to 3 degrees. You probably wouldn't want any more than that.
Yep...I got the same Tokico's with the same -3 camber now on the rears.
Might want to consider seeing if they can make a correction kit first, because if you go lower than the tokico's without a correction kit......your gonna be eating tires like crazy. I have to rotate mine every 1000 miles or so, which at that point they already have inside edge tire wear.

okay, I'll ask them to see what they can do for camber correction before I give them a final decision on springs.

Might want to consider seeing if they can make a correction kit first, because if you go lower than the tokico's without a correction kit......your gonna be eating tires like crazy. I have to rotate mine every 1000 miles or so, which at that point they already have inside edge tire wear.
Negative camber isn't the biggest factor in the tire wear problems. It's toe that causes most of the tire wear. I bet if you go and get an alignment done, you'll notice MUCH better tire wear. On our rear suspension, if you lower the car, you also change toe quite a bit, so an alignment is important after making ride height changes. I noticed a lot better tire wear after my alignment.

This sounds kick ass! I think it would be too much for a 2" drop. I would like to go 1.5" all around with stiffer rate Non progressive. then some adjustible shocks/ struts.

We're never going to get a consensus about how much of a drop, or what spring rate, etc. I assume they're going to just make one setup for the springs, with a specific drop and spring rate? So that will leave the hardcore guys out in left field still. I'm with Jaster, in that I want rear springs with a rate of around 500lb/in, however, I would want to be quite a bit lower than him. Or, is there a possibility of the company making a few different setups for springs?

Also the bottome nipple that the spring sits on had to be bashed in to properly sit the new springs

:laugh: Hehe, he said "nipple."

Not sure if it helps anything, but I've got a brand new set of ST front springs for the Z31 here if we need to do any checking on. I could pull the old ones out of one of my cars also, but I'm not sure how much you could learn from them since they're all old and wore out. But I'd be willing to do that for education's sake... :mrgreen:

I think u should make a couple of rear sets just for all the guys with diffrent hp. For ex. A 325lb and a 425lbs rear. Just a opinion

Maybe a 500lb rear just for the guys with 200hp+ in the rear wheels. Anyways i hope u make the right choice for i will need a pair as well. Good luck!

haha okay guys, I'm just relaying what we want.

iono if they'll wanna make specialty sets. so that's why we need to decide on a general spring length and rate.

and I guess if you want some specially made, you can contact them privately.

Negative camber isn't the biggest factor in the tire wear problems. It's toe that causes most of the tire wear. I bet if you go and get an alignment done, you'll notice MUCH better tire wear. On our rear suspension, if you lower the car, you also change toe quite a bit, so an alignment is important after making ride height changes. I noticed a lot better tire wear after my alignment.
Actually just had an alignment about 4 months ago, and the toe is within specs........but camber is still -3 degrees out on each side.
I got the springs about 3 years ago, and probably have had 3-5 4 wheel alignments at different shops with the same outcome at each place.

You need to start cornering harder. :p

Sounds good to me, except when it comes to me I dont know anything about suspension :lol: , but I like the price.

id like to see 1.75" front and rear drop with a good 400 lb rate. ive had lots of different springs in my day, and i really like the stiffness. i like taking turns fast. ive had h&r race springs with kyb struts on the saturn, now it sports true progress coilovers. i liked both pretty equally.

i think 1.5" will not be low enough, and 2" will be too low. keep in mind the spring will actually seat and break in so to speak and youll get a hair more than the advertised drop.

I agree with the camber correction on the rear. i havent had any real time to tinker with the nissan yet, but ive gathered tons of info and lots of good pics. i also think this would be better than the 280fr and 300rr spring deal. i have those sitting in the garage, but ill give those up in a heartbeat for something specifically designed for the s12.

keep us updated :D

I agree with the 1.75inch drop and a 400lb spring rate, thats prabobly the best set up for our cars!

400 all around?

anybody have the specs for the stock springs by any chance? cause my car is already "lowered" cause of that pesky thing we call time...

or will the springs be fine cause they'll jack up the car and take measurements with the springs when they're not under load?

anyways...I'm not too familiar with suspension...and I know how you can adjust toe when it's a double wishbone suspension and have an upper and lower control arm, but how do you do it on our setup where it's just one trailing arm?

camber tops too?

You need to start cornering harder. :p lol :) thats right lol. I have no problems with my camber in front and rear. the tire ware is even on my car. lol Yeah I would see a prob if you dont corner at speed. And remember I said they wear evenly! Not that they last long. lol

And Indy I know this is way off what others are sayin, but I would love 3 -3 1/2 in. drop 250lb front and 375lbs - 450lbs in the rear. this wouldn't be very street-abel but alot of fun on the track.

sorry, I wouldn't be suggesting that drop as one of the general ones made.

what does everybody think of the 1.75" drop and 400lbs all around..

maybe 350lbs in front and 400lbs in the rear? (this would be more of an oversteering setup)

400lbs front and 350lbs rear? (that would be more of an understeer setup..but it could be offset from camber if you have it)

or a nice 350lbs - 400lbs all around(more neutral)

i like the 1.75" with 400Lb springs

well guys...I'll be calling on wed afternoon when I wake up from my FIRST DAY AFTER FINALS WOOHOO!!!! and schedule to bring my car in on saturday.

tentatively, the drop I'll be saying is 1.75" all around and a spring rate of 375lbs all around.

and yes, I'll be discussing with them camber correction options for the front and rear.

let me know if there are any objections or better suggestions for a general spring(drop and rate) that we can all agree upon.

that sounds like a great setup. I'll go with that. Only thing I gotta ask is, how high will that put our lic plates (front) and the middle of our headlights from the ground up?

Hawaii got some stupid law, that deals with moddin cars....just a stupid tax thing....its ridiculous. Put it this way, an EVO doesnt even PASS this inspection STOCK! hahaha.

it should still be okay.

it won't drop too much having a 375lbs-in spring rate and only 1.75" drop...

We have a similar rule here, but I think ours is the headlights cause the license plate can be mounted anywhere on the front/rear bumper cover as long as it's visible

OH..and also..progressive or non-progressive springs?

Linear would be more performance oriented, whereas progressive would give more cushion. I dont' mind either..but I think the majority of you would like linear.

Hey i just dropped in. When will the springs be ready to order cuz im tired of asking all the other companies to custom make them. All of them want like $300 just for the springs.

please go through and actually read the thread.

thanks ;)

Sounds good with the 1.75" and 375 lbs springs. I'd rather have linear springs, and I think most people here would be the same...

im in for 375lbs 1.75 drop linear spring.

1.75 375lbs linear excellent choice :hitit: i want now!!!

id do about 425-450 up front and 350-375 up back any tighter up back and your car will get very ass happy

Although I like my car ass happy, I agree with Bart. For the majority of people out there, you're going to want a stiffer spring up front. I would say 400 front and 350 rear. And go for the 2 inch drop. You know you want it! :-P

even with the #'s i posted you will still be able to kick the ass out easily, but if the rear is too tight..especially since our ass is lighter then the front you will have way to much ass happiness...whcih would hinder cornering performance

lol okay...so 400 up front and 350 in the rear...

linear.

I dunno about 2" drop tho. having to dial in 3 degrees of positive camber would make the camber correction kit more expensive...

400lbs, 350lbs, 1.5"-1.75" linear, camber correction... with that general consenus, what are we looking at for wear chateristics, and any estimate on the camber correction? I may get them for ease's sake, but ralling's still looking like fun...

would these springs only work for IRS, or could solid rear axle guys get in on the fun too?

sorry. suspension no0b. does having the live axel affect what springs you can use?

Maybe we should consider dropping the front a bit more then the rears. 2inch drop in the front and 1.75 rears. It will give the car a very nice stance and when under load, or fast take off it will sit eveanly. It also looks like a nice drift set up. The spring rates i thing are good both ways.Question:The 240sx has a 50\50 wieght disstrupution, what does our s12 have????THis should confirm what spring rate set up would work best!

The front sitting lower than the rear is NOT a good drift setup. Our cars are a little front heavy, especially the VG guys. You want the rear sitting at least even with the front. However, car setup is very driver dependent, so do whatever works best for you.

I dunno about 2" drop tho. having to dial in 3 degrees of positive camber would make the camber correction kit more expensive...Why not have a camber correction kit made that can suit everyone? Why limit it to barely any adjustment. Cost increase would be nominal, if there is any at all. In truth, if I could get my camber to something more along the lines of 1.5 degrees, I'd be pretty darn happy. So the camber correction kit would only need to take out 1.5 - 2 degrees for me anyway.

oh..well I was thinking adjustable camber correction...

heh didn't even occur to me about permanent.

either way, I'll talk to them. gonna call them later today to make an appointment.

and yes, we're front heavy. so I don't think it would be a good idea to lower the front more.

Who said anything about permanent?

lol iono...

OKAY...just called to make an appointment. it's saturday the 18th for 9am. *cries* I gotta pay them to take it out and re-install too!!!

so you guys better appreciate this! hehe. good thing is, they said they'd pay half of that fee. so it's "only" $75.

s'all good. hopefully they'll cut me a deal on springs/camber kit if enough people buy.

edit: they're not sure if there's gonna be any interest in this. so if you ARE 100% interested..or semi interested in these springs. let them know!

their website is http://www.canuckmotorsports.com and you can send inquiries to [email removed] about the springs.

so guys, send in your e-mails asking about these springs!!!

we'll never get aftermarket support unless we, the owners, show people we want and deserve it.

Ok kid, seeing that you have to shell out some $$ just to take the springs out and back for measurement, I guess I could lend you my stock turbo springs that are sitting in the corner of my garage.

Ok kid, seeing that you have to shell out some $$ just to take the springs out and back for measurement, I guess I could lend you my stock turbo springs that are sitting in the corner of my garage.

And the Bossman comes to the rescue. :banger:

Ok kid, seeing that you have to shell out some $$ just to take the springs out and back for measurement, I guess I could lend you my stock turbo springs that are sitting in the corner of my garage.

edited out # can I get them from you on friday?

lemme know. no worries..I'll give them back too..ahhaha

Sent them an e-mail. Hope everything works out good and we can get springs and camber kits! :mike:

.......and I take it you need some spring specs too........I'll ring you later Indy